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[mhitesman]

Second on the fish (salmon) oil!  I also give a multivitamin daily (Cosequin D).  I think the vitamin is maybe overkill for my dogs as the salmon oil and the food are probably enough.  BUT, River has Grade 1 elbow dysplasia and needs joint supplements, so the Cosequin D is a joint supplement with the vitaim roled into it.

From all the comments about diet and food over the past year, I have readily observed that the people on this forum are not the typical dog owners in many respects -- but particularly in what we feed out dogs.  I am curious -- did a particular event get you feeding better or have you always been so smart?  In my case, the "food scare" got me researching.

[KoKo]

I ignorantly assumed nutro was a permium dog food (after all i was paying a premium price).... it was Marilyn that made me aware of some alterantives/nutros low quality.

I ended up with orijen based on its quality and availability near me

No the problem with treats.... i thought Jerky Tenders were awsome - pure chicken breast.... did a ton of research found out dogs are dying on them, there has been recalls, etc.

All due to the chemical being fed to the chickens... another product being produced in china. 

What is guy to treat with?  Any awesome recipies?  What shoulld i be buying?

[Judy]

When Francie came to live with me (3 years ago as an adopted show dog) she did ok for 2 months until something happened when she stayed with a poodle - she ended up with continual diarrhea. After treating her with antibiotics once, and realizing that she really had colitis - possibly brought on by stress, I took her to an acupucturist who told me that the food I was giving her (some kind of organic dry food - can't remember now) was too heating - so I started researching what would help with constant diarrhea...I started with probiotics, slippery elm powder (when active diarrhea) rice, hamburger from Whole Foods that was boiled (it seemed she couldn't handle any fat), and pumpkin.

This worked really well until her blasto --then another vet acupuncturist suggested that perhaps it wasn't balanced (I tried with Pritkin's recommendations, but his calcium was not the best kind and I figured her calcium was in the cottage cheese). Since being on the raw foods, she hasn't had a problem with diarrhea unless I do something that I shouldn't like give her something I am eating that she is begging for and I can't refuse - but I learned my lesson. In the am since blasto I started making scrambled eggs - just the plain eggs and giving her 1/4 of them when I was finished - that has continued - it is really hard to say no to her but the egg is fine....

With blasto she was so skinny that I didn't worry about the amount of food/snacks but now she has become a #40 dog (when sick she went down to 32#) so I am now starting to cut back - but she somehow must know. My question to the group is, if a dog goes the other way - my thought is that this couldn't be blasto or a side effect to the compounding medicine, could it? She has been on the compounded itra for two weeks now...has alot more energy, but is gaining weight...  Judy/Francie

[mhitesman]

Haha, Judy.  You might have Koko and Comet Disease... we GAINED WEIGHT during initial blasto treatment too!  Comet, like Koko I think, have mild cases of blasto.  Comet's number was under 5.0 and is considered a weak positive.   He lost his eye, and he was sick with fever, etc. but as soon as the infected eye was removed, he began to love eating again...and boy did I cook for him:-)  Since he was getting meds as well, he also got them rolled up in luncheon meats like beef bologna and turkey breast.  I soft boiled eggs, grated parmesan cheese, etc....  Overall, he gained 6 pounds in the first month of treatment.  Comet was not on any steroids (other than drops for his eye before it was removed) but if your dog is or has been, that will increase their appetites more as well.  Of course, a dog cannot eat more if we don't give him more ...  my guess is that your dog, like my dog, has a mild case and that you, also like me, are feeding your dog a lot more than usual.

[mhitesman]

Hey Koko,
I feel a little guilty about not talking about those chicken treats with you more when you first mentioned them.  I used to give them to Comet and River thinking they were wonderful as well.  I mean, the bag says their is nothing but chicken in them, right?  Then I read, online, that there was a recall of them.  I think it was salmonella?  I threw out what I had and quit buying them.  I have not seen another recall, but I have not been looking either.  I did not mention it to you because I don't think salmonella recalls are as bad as some of the other recalls in that I dont think it means that the food is deadly.  Salmonella poisoning can happen in your own kitchen.  It is, also, more likely related to one or two batches or runs on a certain day or something like that.  My hope and belief was that they are sterilizing their equipment better now, and the problem is over.  I don't even know if a healthy dog can become seriously sick from eating a few dog treats infected with salmonella bacteria. I think symptoms are like bad stomach flu?  But, I really figured the company fixed the problem by now.  Did you catch a date on the recall?  I am wondering if they have been recalled again?  I think it was six months or more ago that I saw it.

With regard to treats for my dogs, I make liver treats for them.  It's all they get by way of  "treats" .  The recipe is simple, and I make a triple batch and freeze a lot.  Liver can make the stool a little loose, so they only get three or four a day at most -- except on baking day of course :-)

They do have grain in them, but it has not been a problem for allergy at this point.  They have wheat germ, wheat flour, beef or chicken liver, and garlic.  I think that's it.  Quick to make, but you do have to grind the livers.  My KA mixer has a grinder attachment, but I would think any hand grinder would work.  A butcher could also grind it before you leave the store.

If you would like the recipe, I can post it here.

[Judy]

Thanks, I just realized that yes, Francie was on steroids for about 3 weeks prior to her diagnosis, but that was in May - could she still be ravenous because of this? Hmmmm I'm going to think about this a bit = there are things I can give her to support her adrenals - and since Portuguese Water dogs are prone to Addisons disease  you have me thinking about it - yes, the definite problem is in MY giving her food (and my giving myself food - it still is very hard since my brother's death - and I am so happy to have Francie - I don't know what I would do without her - so I will look into this - yes, I advise others, but now it is time to figure this out and get an objective opinion - smiles)...please everybody, keep up on the recal info, that is so true about the salmonella recall. It included brans such as Pedigree, Members Mark, Wegman's Pet Pride nd PMI Nutrition. There is a list of recalled foods on petcare.mars.com   just one more reason to really know what we are feeding our children/pets.  Judy/Francie

[mhitesman]

I considered the Pritkin diet of raw foods for my dogs.  I even bought all the supplements for it and gave them some raw ground round ...then I got scared about salmonella for them and went back almost immediately to kibble.  I mean, if humans need to cook ground beef to well done to avoid salmonella, and dogs are known to get salmonella, how do you be sure they are safe?  Do you worry about salmonella in the raw diet -- or are you grinding your own steak or what?

Interesting that your dog was on (oral) steroids a few weeks before blasto diagnosis.  My dog was too...treatment for the uveitis ...without consideration or diagnosis of blasto.  Of course, steroids suppress the immune system which helped the blasto get stronger in his body and probably cost him his eye.

I do not believe that the steroids your dog received three weeks prior to blasto diagnosis are STILL increasing the appetite.  My .02

[Judy]

I agree - but that is why I am still wondering what is going on. It took me three years to think about the raw diet - so for those three years I was boiling her ground round hamburger from Whole Foods so there wouldn't be any steroids, hormones etc in it. I finally read an article about dogs having a very short digestive track, but I don't advocate a strictly raw food diet for people. The raw food is made in Wisconsin and then flash frozen, I defrost it for 12 hours in the refrig and then feed it to her. I saw a sudden improvement when I started on the cooked meat - she had lots more energy three years ago, and with the next change to the raw, I am amazed at her energy also, now it could be that she had blasto for the last two years or so and it was low grade, so the improvement came with the itraconazole - but I think it was the food. I couldn't see giving her just plain raw hamburger meat - but I am open to looking at other options and seeing if there is something better or if this is a problem. But so far it doesn't seem to a problem but a good thing for her. I think that salmonella is in everything as is other bacteria and viruses, but at a low level and controlled by the immune system itself, in which case I also gave her probiotics for about three months - which is also helpful. When we read about salmonella poisoning, it is the high level, but I would agree that raw food is not for every dog.  The Chinese medicine/ND specialist in Canada that I also consulted with  at the beginning of her blasto tx, hesitated for a minute when I said I wanted to go raw, but then said in her case that this would be fine and helpful for her immune system. I think it is because she tends towards a hot constitution (thus the past irritable bowel), and that this would be cooling (possibly) - which would balance her out.

[paintubturner]

Could someone please help with dogfood research.  I am feeding Nutro Ultro Holistic and I have been reading alot of negative comments about Nutro on this site.  Is the Ultra Holisitic just as bad as the others you have mentioned?  The prices have went up on the Nutro since I started feeding it last year and it is to the point i need to be switching the dogs to something more affordable.  They are all doing awesome on the food and I havent had one single problem but due to financial reasons I have to change.  So what is a good food to feed but one that is affordable?? 

[mhitesman]

Boy, I don't know...  I advise you to read the ingredients list on any food you are considering.  Stay away from grains and glutens ...they are fillers and not digestible by the dogs...and the most common source of allergy problems.  There should be no chemicals or preservatives or dyes.  Ingredients are listed in order of highest percentage in the food; the first ingredients should be meat.  Meat by-products are a no-no as they are usually animal waste such as hooves, beaks, innards, etc.  FDA-approved is not a good thing.  Although it sounds good, it means that the food consists of the parts that are NOT approved for human consumption.  Weird, eh?

Depending upon where you live, there may be some local providers.  My son, in Minneapolis, feeds good food that is delivered to his door each week.  On a national scale, good food that can compete favorably in price takes more research...by reading the bags and searching online.  The Taste of the Wild that I feed is $50 for a 30# bag at the nearest pet store.  It is not carried at Petsmart or the like.  Online, at www.heartypet.com it is $42.80 plus shipping.  If you sign up for their email, they offer free or reduced shipping frequently which eliminates or reduces the $10/bag shipping fees by Fedex Home Delivery.  Still, it is probably still more than the Nutro Ultra Holistic maybe?  Canidae used to make a wonderful food that was very competitively priced, but they have switched to Diamond Foods manufacture, and I not only feel that the quality went down but Diamond Foods has demonstrated over the year that they dont mind killing a few pets here and there.

Sometimes the recommended feeding amount is often less with high quality foods.  My #70 golden retriever (who gets lots of exercise) eats 2.5 - 3.0 cups of Taste of the Wild daily.  That is a cup or more less than what he received with Canidae, Purina Pro Plan, Nature's Choice, and the Nutro he was on in previous years.  I do supplement with 1/4 or 1/2 cup cooked meat each night though....but was doing so always.  My 72# lab, by contrast, gets 4 cups per day as he is even higher drive and exercise (read HYPER here), but he got 5 c on previous foods.

Hearty Pet sells pretty good food (I really dont have any affiliation with them!!!) and is a good place to do a little research as there are customer ratings there, and they carry all the good foods as well as show the ingredient lists.

I wish I could give you the name of a food, but I haven't been shopping around for awhile.  I know this:  since feeding higher quality food (and I never knew I wasn't feeding the best food from the beginning!), neither of my dogs has had one health issue (other than the blasto, of course, which I think Comet already had when I made the switch) where they previously always had something going on.  Changing their food and seeing the positive results has actually changed my family's diet as well...it is just that apparent to me.  So, for me, I feel I am saving money at the vet by feeding my dogs food that I know is great.

I wish I had a one-line answer.  Sorry to make you read to the end to find out I don't :-)  Oh, and Nutro Ultra Holistic may be great food... many of the companies that make junk are trying to improve the foods as customers become more demanding and savvy shoppers.  And just because a food is good right now does not mean the manufacturer will continue down that same path in their quest to expand and make more money...we have to be constantly vigilant and can never assume that any company really cares about our pets.